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ff 3/6 thoughts

#1
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So i already have an idea on what i want to change in my hack thought it would be intersting to ask others though.

What characters spells or gear do you think is the worst or completely useless?
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#2
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Spells: Drain(learned too slow for how bad it is), Break(no reason to use this when Doom is almost objectively better(Break checks ID and Petrify immunity)), Pearl(too weak for how late/tedious it is to learn), Demi(does too little), Quartr(does too little, costs too much, too inaccurate), Meteor(I hate this spell in general, too hard to learn for how bad it is, too weak/too costly when compared to Ultima), Quake(too niche), W Wind(too niche), Scan(does too little), Rasp(too niche), Haste and Haste2(does too little), Dispel(too niche), Antdot(does too little), Regen(does too little), all damaging summons aside from Bahamut(can't use more than once, does too little, too costly).

Gear: Any weapon or helmet that does not provide a significant Magic Power boost, MEvade boost, or some other special effect(Red Cap is good, for example). A lot of the weaker armor is somewhat redundant(LeatherArmor, Silk Robe, Cotton Robe, Kung Fu Suit? Not much use for all four of them, one would be good enough if everyone could use it, given that they're nearly identical) A lot of the more obscure gear is also not super useful because of how obscure it is(Cat Hood, Merit Award, Marvel Shoes are all good, but if you're knowledgeable enough to get them, you're knowledgeable enough to not need them). The Imp gear is probably too difficult to obtain for how niche it is(it's not difficult to obtain per se, but if you know how to get it, you probably don't need it). The Thornlet is also basically worthless. The Chocobo/Moogle/Tabby Suits aren't particularly noteworthy, and neither are the MithrilGlove, Barrier Ring, Czarina Ring, Goggles, Sniper Sight, Cursed Ring, Crystal Orb, Gauntlet, Hyper Wrist, Black Belt, Relic Ring, or Tintinabar.


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  • Hashimo (11-15-2018)

#3
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Thanks for some of the ideas i already buffed some of the spells
I plan on making a caster armor group that only Terra celes strago relm maybe mog can wear
a light armor that some are for all but others that are limited to the locke shadow etc.
And a heavy group that only edgar cyan setzer can wear they will provide the best defense and all the heavy helmet's protect vs dark so almost like a free relic

Probably going to axe the imp gear completley and combine it with the other armors to free up some space
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While Cecil is kinda right on most of the stuff he mentioned and still i think that something in the list might be saved or tweaked at least...
i actually think you shouldn't rely too much on answers about game balancement: this is where i believe you should experience it on your skin, i mean...
find out for yourself, getting your point of view is quite important  Hold on


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  • Hashimo (11-16-2018)

#5
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About the crappier character spells: monsters of course use them also, so while they may not be the best for characters to use, they help to make the monster spells that much more diverse and usually will work better against you, the player lol. Also if you were to buff them or change them to something 'better', it might suck that much more getting them cast upon you! So in other words, they might suck, but they do serve a purpose, albeit for the monster AI. Smile


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  • Hashimo (11-16-2018)

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Spell wise, I think there's a few you could probably replace with a player spell like Blaze with fire 1 or fire 2 as it would probably serve the exact same purpose. I don't know of any specific monsters that use blaze and something else where you couldn't just use fire 1 and increase their magic level to match the damage output or something to that effect.

But you'd have to be pretty knowledgeable about which monsters use which spells (or painstakingly go over all their scripts) so you don't have something small doing outrageous amounts of damage they were never intended to have.

Some of the 'useless' spells I can think of would be that one that changes you to or from the back and front rows.
There's probably a few too many instant death spells that could just be replaced with doom or x-zone and not have a major change in the monster battles. It would take some research really to be entirely sure.

Sabin's Spiraler or whatever it's called Blitz is absolutely the most useless ability in the game. I can't think of an instance where you'd want to kill Sabin and remove him from the battle to heal your party (which may or may not be similar to Pep Up in terms of strategic viability). It entirely denies Sabin from ever being a contender in the Colosseum because he'll random commit suicide. For similar reasons, Gau, Gogo, Strago are all potential for suicide Colosseum fights as well. (Gogo for taking Blitz, Rage or Lore and following Sabin, Gau and Strago's suicide lesson.)
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I hate Steal.  You've got to use a relic slot to make it have any reasonable chance to work, and another to do damage that turn.  It's a complete waste.
I've seen a lot of people recommend that mods replace it with Capture outright, but I've got a different approach I'm going to try: putting the Thief's Knife ability on ALL daggers, restricting them to Locke, and then giving him X-Attack as a special (with an ASM patch by Madsiur to make it randomly strike 2-4 times). EDIT: Scratch that, I thought X-Attack was a separate battle command that could be set in another slot.  It's relic controlled, and I haven't figured out how to simulate relic effects on stuff other than equipment yet.  So I guess the Capture swap really is the best option.

As mentioned earlier, Haste2 and Slow2 are a waste of spell slots.  Letting Haste and Slow multi-target for double MP cost (like every other spell) is a much better option, and frees up some spell space.  Same goes for Protect and Shell, and possibly Antidote.
...Speaking of which, Antidote needs to remove more status ailments or Poison needs to be much more dangerous. There's a patch that makes it and Seize calculate based on max HP, though, which would make Antidote more important.

Not a fan of Slot.  People have tried to fix it, but it's either too weak or too strong.

Merton's pretty bad.  I've got an idea to make it more interesting, which you can try if you like:
>Inflicts 16/16ths of target's HP, killing everything on screen that has less than 9999 HP (including your party).  Non-elemental, cannot be dodged.
>Casts Life3 on every target hit.
Basically, it does huge damage to boss enemies, but they'll raise with 1/16th their HP after you beat them if you've cast the spell this fight.  Likewise, it puts your entire party into critical.  More effective with a damage cap lift.

X-Zone is the worst spell, though.  Not because it's useless, but because it's TOO useful.  There's no reason to ever bother learning or using Doom.
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I love steal. Free items.

What you could have do, if you hate it so much, change the steal rate to 100% (same item twice), and make the worst item (dirk) randomly steal that everyone can use.

I always liked the "You have one less party member until you get the item" restriction. Usually I have Locke spam steal and never do anything else unless he's gotten something from every monster.
It's a little disappointing when an RPG lacks a steal-item mechanic or when every boss has nothing.
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Well it's like complaining about healer because you have to waste turns to heal yourself: thief is a job like all the others, so i don't mind investing some turn in stealing attempts, what maybe i dislike is placing a crappy steal as common along with the rare one, since after you steal the common you'll lose the chance to steal the rare one... you should put common steal OR rare one, at least this is how i'd probably do for my hack


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#10
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(01-12-2019, 01:19 PM)Tenkarider Wrote: Well it's like complaining about healer because you have to waste turns to heal yourself: thief is a job like all the others, so i don't mind investing some turn in stealing attempts, what maybe i dislike is placing a crappy steal as common along with the rare one, since after you steal the common you'll lose the chance to steal the rare one... you should put common steal OR rare one, at least this is how i'd probably do for my hack

I don't think this is an accurate comparison.

Health is a combat mechanic.  Replenishing health contributes to your success against the opponent.

Steal, however, is a world mechanic.  It is a substitute for purchasing objects with gold, which makes it a form of character experience.  When you steal items, you're basically adding bonus shop experience to the fight.  If the items to be stolen CAN'T be acquired in another way, then it's a direct penalty for not bringing the thief to the party.  The Steal command is effectively incentivizing using a weak character with the threat of missing out on something good.  It's feeding on missable rewards, which I personally find distasteful.

There are FF games that did a better job with it.  For instance, Final Fantasy X had a very good steal mechanic: using steal gave you things to throw and mix (used by the same character) and also acted as a death spell against machine-enemies.  You also had the option to switch out your thief when you were done with her, save a few underwater sections where she was required.

While I can't hold it against FF6 for not having an idea before it was invented, I think Steal as a command is a fairly good candidate if a modder is looking to replace something.
Such as, say, throwing weapons being the things you steal and the person with the thieving daggers having the throw command.
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